Situation in Oaxaca - Page 4

PlayadelSoul · 10-30-2006

Justmy, some of us sleep. So, when you post something in the middle of the night, you probably do not want to hold your breath waiting for a reply.

Nice to see that you were busy looking for links. Next time, try to find some that are not leftist US blogs and travel brochures. One of them even refers to Calderon as "right wing", which is just plain silly. If he were a candidate in the US, he would probably be a Democrat.

I did not claim that there are no problems with the indigenous people of Oaxaca. It is probably the poorest state in Mexico. My point was about the current conflict with the teachers and the state. The information I present comes to me from a variety of friends in Oaxaca, none of whom are political. They are on the scene and have no agenda, other than try to get to work without being mugged or shot.

Every year, in Oaxaca, the teachers go on strike. It is on the school calendar. Every year, the union reps visit the Governor and they do this little dance where they pretend to negotiate, and the union leaders leave with a raise for their teachers, and a little extra for their household expenses (mordida). This year the teachers union had two demands. 100 percent raise for the teachers and the removal of the Governor from office. Well, the Governor, being extra crooked, had already spent the money earmarked for the teachers and their union leaders. Oops! Now, the teachers are pissed.

With a Presidential election being challenged, PRD sees a chance to show the rest of Mexico what might happen in AMLO is not given his way. And, here we are.

Your original statment was that Fox was somehow negligent in his lack of response. Truth is, that before the violence last week, it was considered a state problem. Like the US, there is a separation of what is considered federal and what is considered state. Your leftist mind might have a problem with that ideal, as you probably believe the feds should handle everything. However, that is the way it is.

Finally, SubCommandante Marcos is a non entity in Mexico. He is a darling of American leftists, but is lampooned in Mexico. Like most Che wannabes, the American left bestows on him much more power than he really possesses. AMLO is the new hero of the left in Mexico, and his welcome is being worn out, real fast.

There are real problems in Mexico. A lot of them stem from those in charge of the unions, who do not really care about their constituents as long as they are getting their piece of the corruption pie.

Mexivoof · 10-30-2006

Cripes, does every thread have to become politicized

Who cares who is causing the problems, I just want to know if they've been rectified!

fryman · 10-30-2006

Troops are in at last. Its about time, this was a never ending conflict.

It is hell over there right now.

PlayadelSoul · 10-30-2006

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mexivoof

Cripes, does every thread have to become politicized

Who cares who is causing the problems, I just want to know if they've been rectified!

Its important to know which side of the street to walk on, if you find yourself in Oaxaca. I will be in the state in 3 weeks, although far removed from the problems.

**sctx** · 10-30-2006

Quote:

Originally Posted by PlayadelSoul

I will be in the state in 3 weeks, although far removed from the problems.

well, don't let that swell your head, real time experience doesn't count for knowledge

PlayadelSoul · 10-30-2006

Quote:

Originally Posted by sctx

well, don't let that swell your head, real time experience doesn't count for knowledge

The only experience I will be getting will be poolside. It is the annual pat ourselves on the back, mini-vacation convention.

Mexivoof · 10-30-2006

OK, this thread is totally bent, so there is no beach, but it seems like a lot of boobs

Sol · 10-30-2006

Quote:

Originally Posted by itsmysecondtime

Re-read my post Sol and see how you responded. I can understand an ideologue like PDS to be blinded by his myopia, but expected a bit more out of you.

OUCH!

I'll clarify. Maybe I am wrong, but often times what I have seen throughout Mexican history is that a group will get together to protest some type of inequality or opression and someone butts in to try to resolve their issues. One example is the student movement of 1968. While students were trying to protest academic freedom, the CIA and the Mexican government saw this as an opportunity to go after communists in Mexico. As a result, there was a huge massacre on October 2, 1968 in Mexico City. In this present case, rather than just a group of teachers protesting, it is two groups that have different interests than the teachers. It's gone beyond protesting for higher wages and on to trying to unseat a very corrupt governor. But at the same time, it all ties in: a governor who spends too much money and does not have priorities.
Regarding indigenous groups in Oaxaca or any other state for that matter, these people are disregarded. I believe that they are an important part of the fabric of Mexican society. Poor opportunities for education in Oaxaca is a result of this. Where you see large populations of indigenous peoples in Mexico, you will see lower pay for teachers and not the best opportunities for students. Look at all of the donations that SarahB is always collecting for local schools. Children are lacking the essentials for class.

Sol · 10-30-2006

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mexivoof

Cripes, does every thread have to become politicized

Who cares who is causing the problems, I just want to know if they've been rectified!

No they have not. If the troops are coming in, it is only going to get worse.
I spoke with a friend this morning who has some buddies vacationing in Oaxaca. They have not encountered any problems and have pretty much been left alone.

davpar · 10-31-2006

This mornings news about the situation:
http://news.sympatico.msn.ctv.ca/Top...howbyline=True

Icon oclast · 10-31-2006

The French are bogged down in the Muslim city of Paris. The insurgency grows as more buses are being firebombed. How fast will they capitulate and give the insurgents their city back.

Rissask · 10-31-2006

Quote:

Originally Posted by PlayadelSoul

Its important to know which side of the street to walk on, if you find yourself in Oaxaca. I will be in the state in 3 weeks, although far removed from the problems.

Where are you going, exactly, PDS? PE, Zipolite, Huatulco? Have a good time.

I have been keeping an eye on tomzap, things are safe at the coastal resort areas.

This whole situation is so sad....that area was just starting to take off as a popular vacation destination.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mexivoof
Cripes, does every thread have to become politicized Who cares who is causing the problems, I just want to know if they've been rectified!

I find it difficult to understand how this thread cannot have become political...good grief! "just tell me if I can go there safely or not, don't discuss the problem at all"???

Sol · 10-31-2006

Quote:

Originally Posted by davpar

This mornings news about the situation:
http://news.sympatico.msn.ctv.ca/Top...howbyline=True

Thanks for the article.

PlayadelSoul · 10-31-2006

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rissask

Where are you going, exactly, PDS? PE, Zipolite, Huatulco? Have a good time.

I have been keeping an eye on tomzap, things are safe at the coastal resort areas.

This whole situation is so sad....that area was just starting to take off as a popular vacation destination.

I find it difficult to understand how this thread cannot have become political...good grief! "just tell me if I can go there safely or not, don't discuss the problem at all"???

Huatulco. It will be my fourth time. I like it, but really wish they would change locations one year. It is the company's 40th anniversary, so it should be fun.

Rissask · 10-31-2006

Quote:

Originally Posted by PlayadelSoul

Huatulco. It will be my fourth time. I like it, but really wish they would change locations one year. It is the company's 40th anniversary, so it should be fun.

cool, have fun- where you staying?

10-30-2006	#46 (permalink)
PlayadelSoul añejo Join Date: May 2005 Location: We'll know when we get there, We'll find mercy Posts: 8,963	Justmy, some of us sleep. So, when you post something in the middle of the night, you probably do not want to hold your breath waiting for a reply. Nice to see that you were busy looking for links. Next time, try to find some that are not leftist US blogs and travel brochures. One of them even refers to Calderon as "right wing", which is just plain silly. If he were a candidate in the US, he would probably be a Democrat. I did not claim that there are no problems with the indigenous people of Oaxaca. It is probably the poorest state in Mexico. My point was about the current conflict with the teachers and the state. The information I present comes to me from a variety of friends in Oaxaca, none of whom are political. They are on the scene and have no agenda, other than try to get to work without being mugged or shot. Every year, in Oaxaca, the teachers go on strike. It is on the school calendar. Every year, the union reps visit the Governor and they do this little dance where they pretend to negotiate, and the union leaders leave with a raise for their teachers, and a little extra for their household expenses (mordida). This year the teachers union had two demands. 100 percent raise for the teachers and the removal of the Governor from office. Well, the Governor, being extra crooked, had already spent the money earmarked for the teachers and their union leaders. Oops! Now, the teachers are pissed. With a Presidential election being challenged, PRD sees a chance to show the rest of Mexico what might happen in AMLO is not given his way. And, here we are. Your original statment was that Fox was somehow negligent in his lack of response. Truth is, that before the violence last week, it was considered a state problem. Like the US, there is a separation of what is considered federal and what is considered state. Your leftist mind might have a problem with that ideal, as you probably believe the feds should handle everything. However, that is the way it is. Finally, SubCommandante Marcos is a non entity in Mexico. He is a darling of American leftists, but is lampooned in Mexico. Like most Che wannabes, the American left bestows on him much more power than he really possesses. AMLO is the new hero of the left in Mexico, and his welcome is being worn out, real fast. There are real problems in Mexico. A lot of them stem from those in charge of the unions, who do not really care about their constituents as long as they are getting their piece of the corruption pie. __________________

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10-30-2006	#47 (permalink)
Mexivoof añejo Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Milwaukee, WI Posts: 3,096	Cripes, does every thread have to become politicized Who cares who is causing the problems, I just want to know if they've been rectified!

10-30-2006	#48 (permalink)
fryman way into it Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Vancouver, BC Posts: 108	Troops are in at last. Its about time, this was a never ending conflict. It is hell over there right now.

10-30-2006	#52 (permalink)
Mexivoof añejo Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Milwaukee, WI Posts: 3,096	OK, this thread is totally bent, so there is no beach, but it seems like a lot of boobs

10-31-2006	#55 (permalink)
davpar lost on fifth Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 20	This mornings news about the situation: http://news.sympatico.msn.ctv.ca/Top...howbyline=True

10-31-2006	#56 (permalink)
Icon oclast reposado Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 1,024	The French are bogged down in the Muslim city of Paris. The insurgency grows as more buses are being firebombed. How fast will they capitulate and give the insurgents their city back.

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