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Old 10-29-2006   #31 (permalink)
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It is hard to deny that the Global Warming activists have a political agenda, which is anti globalization and anti business in nature.
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Old 10-29-2006   #32 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by PlayadelSoul
Norway gets warmer, Antartica gets colder. It happens.
Who said Antartica gets colder? I found this:
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Old 10-29-2006   #33 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Thor Henning
Who said Antartica gets colder? I found this:
It was an example, albeit a bad one. Now, I have to go look up the areas that are getting cooler. Be back soon.

Edit> I found this on the first try, which completely contradicts yours. Funny how that works.

http://www.scienceagogo.com/news/200...runc_sys.shtml
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Old 10-29-2006   #34 (permalink)
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It is hard to deny that the Global Warming activists have a political agenda, which is anti globalization and anti business in nature.
Who has a politica agenda? It's leaning both ways I guess.
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Old 10-29-2006   #35 (permalink)
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It was an example, albeit a bad one. Now, I have to go look up the areas that are getting cooler. Be back soon.
I like you PayadelSoul!
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Old 10-29-2006   #36 (permalink)
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I like you PayadelSoul!
Back at you, my Nordic friend.
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Old 10-29-2006   #37 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by PlayadelSoul
Edit> I found this on the first try, which completely contradicts yours. Funny how that works.

http://www.scienceagogo.com/news/200...runc_sys.shtml
You may not trust all you read. But this one is too old. It's from 2002.
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Old 10-29-2006   #38 (permalink)
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Unfortunately, there are many scientists who will say anything, as long as the grant money keeps coming. There are also scientists who put forward their theories in the guise of fact. What Michael pointed out is very valid. 30 years ago, in the NY Times, they told us that we would be freezing today.

If everyone, who thought it was a certainty, turned off their AC, stopped driving, and supported nucear energy, their problem would be solved (at least in the US).
So we should quit listening to our best scientists altogether? Bring on the snake oil!
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Old 10-29-2006   #39 (permalink)
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It is hard to deny that the Global Warming activists have a political agenda, which is anti globalization and anti business in nature.
Cynic I deny it.
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Old 10-29-2006   #40 (permalink)
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You may not trust all you read. But this one is too old. It's from 2002.
Thor, it reads that the temps have been going down for 35 years. What are you saying, that in the last 4 years they started going up? Global warming trends need to be examined over a long period of time, or we will end up trying to control the climate like an air conditioner. Its too hot. No, its too cold, turn it up.
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Old 10-29-2006   #41 (permalink)
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So we should quit listening to our best scientists altogether? Bring on the snake oil!
And, I suppose the best are those that agree with you? My best would be the ones who think that it needs to be looked at more, before we go spending boatloads of money doing the wrong thing.
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Old 10-29-2006   #42 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by PlayadelSoul
Thor, it reads that the temps have been going down for 35 years. What are you saying, that in the last 4 years they started going up? Global warming trends need to be examined over a long period of time, or we will end up trying to control the climate like an air conditioner. Its too hot. No, its too cold, turn it up.
It's hard to know what to believe some times. But all the articles and news I have read lately says global warming is a fact and its happening fast. It's accelerateing and we have little time to act. And if we just wait and see...

And the web site I refered to says this:

Quote:
3/ Is the whole of Antarctica warming?
The short answer is no.
The Antarctic Peninsula, particularly the West coast of the Peninsula is warming at a rate 2 or 3 times faster than the global average. This has received a great deal of publicity in recent years and of course is where the Larsen B ice shelf (see above) is situated. The average annual temperature of this region has increased about 2.5�C in the last 50 years.

However, data on temperatures in Antarctica only really go back about 50 years, anything beyond that is surmised from ice cores or other sources and so we don't really know how the temperatures vary over even the medium term in Antarctica.

The Antarctic Peninsula also represents only about 4% of the whole continent, the other 96% appears to have had a stable temperature over the last 40 years to the extent where the most remarkable aspect is that stability compared to other parts of the world.

One reason that the Peninsula region appears to be so dramatically warming is that it has a large amount of snow and ice, glaciers, ice shelves and other features but has an annual average temperature not far off the freezing point of water. A small increase in the average annual temperature can mean that a few more weeks or even just a few more days per year when melting can occur can result in very visible results of ice features reducing or disappearing.

The vast majority of Antarctica is so cold that even if the temperature was to rise by the same amount as the Peninsula, there still wouldn't be any melting going on at all. The average surface temperature of continental Antarctica is about -37�C as opposed to -5�C for the warmest places on the peninsula.

This is no reason to become complacent however as part of the reason that the Antarctic ice sheet is so cold is that it's so high, due to the thickness of the ice. The melting and flow of the glaciers removing ice from the continent is also slowed by the ice shelves around the continent edge. Small rises in temperature that start to nibble away a little faster at the edges could eventually speed up the loss of ice and cause greater temperature rises to take place further inland.

The problem with trying to predict the future in these matters is that firstly there is not enough data available to base predictions on and secondly, the way things work is not fully understood. Most models from different researchers and teams tend to agree however that there will be some small changes in temperature over the next 50 years. It is also expected that the rise in global temperature will put more moisture into the atmosphere and more of this will reach Antarctica so giving a greater snowfall to offset the melting ice. Despite all the snow and ice there Antarctica is actually classed as a desert as there is so little snow-fall, it's just that what does fall - stays there.

Last edited by Thor Henning; 10-29-2006 at 04:05 PM..
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Old 10-29-2006   #43 (permalink)
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And, I suppose the best are those that agree with you? My best would be the ones who think that it needs to be looked at more, before we go spending boatloads of money doing the wrong thing.
I think one can make a distinction regarding our best scientists that has nothing to do with whether they happen to agree with you or not.

Remember me, I have no vested interest in global warming being right or wrong...for me, there are plenty of other reasons to take the very same remedial action....I do not require being "right" on global warming.
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Old 10-29-2006   #44 (permalink)
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Global warming and cooling has been happening over the past 2000 centuries. What Pollutants caused that? And....why don't those scientists try to stop volcanic eruptions???? They cause more damage to the athmosphere than anything else? You doomsayers need to find more cheerful things to read. Oh yeah, wasn't California supposed to fall into the sea 20 years ago? Weren't we supposed to see 19 bad hurricanes this year? All they can do is predict and it's only 50/50 at best.
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Old 10-29-2006   #45 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Jacko
I think one can make a distinction regarding our best scientists that has nothing to do with whether they happen to agree with you or not.

Remember me, I have no vested interest in global warming being right or wrong...for me, there are plenty of other reasons to take the very same remedial action....I do not require being "right" on global warming.
Again, I agree. Maybe if the politicians would stop running for office for a few days, they might actually find that they agree, too. I doubt it, however.

Not to change the subject, but I think we have invested power to the President that does not belong in his office (Clinton, Bush 1, Reagan, and Carter, too). I believe Congress has completely neglected its duties, since right around the time of Vietnam. I understand the logic behind it, as Congressmen can blame the President if anything goes wrong, and still take credit when it goes right. However, I think they poorly serve the people (Dems and Repubs). It is shameful, really. If the American public sits by while Congress abdicates its powers to the Pres, they really should not be upset when the Pres becomes a King.

It is not the job of the President to make environmental laws. He just needs to sign them, which this President will inevitably do because he cannot spell VETO.
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