Please Stay Aware in Bars/Restaurants

[Michele]

Originally Posted by StewartG

Oh.

Just a suggestion.


Not actually practicing what I preach.

[NWCreoleLady]

Originally Posted by Heather

I keep reading this as "Please stay AWAKE in Bars/Restaurants"

That's exactly what I'm thinking after reading these very informative tips! Thanks everyone!

[Rissask]

I think that often it likely IS just an honest error on the part of the restaurant, and it is likely often just error on the part of the tourist too, not understanding the tax thing...but it's also sometimes restaurant servers (unknown to the management sometimes, but sometimes with their full approval I bet) trying to take advantage of unaware and/or gullible tourists to try to make a bit of extra money for themselves too. Mexican hotel and restaurant owners/apologists notwithstanding.


I know how to read a bill and ask if the 'propina es incluida', or not- or well enough to make myself clear- and we have still been the victims of an attempt to squeeze more pesos out of us than we owe on more than one occaision. Like I said, it's usually been when there is a larger group of us.


This is nothing unique to Mexico, it happens all over the world, and likely far more often in poorer countries, naturally.

Caveat emptor.

[Tommygurl]

Originally Posted by Rissask

I think that often it likely IS just an honest error on the part of the restaurant, and it is likely often just error on the part of the tourist too, not understanding the tax thing...but it's also sometimes restaurant servers (unknown to the management sometimes, but sometimes with their full approval I bet) trying to take advantage of unaware and/or gullible tourists to try to make a bit of extra money for themselves too. Mexican hotel and restaurant owners/apologists notwithstanding.


I know how to read a bill and ask if the 'propina es incluida', or not- or well enough to make myself clear- and we have still been the victims of an attempt to squeeze more pesos out of us than we owe on more than one occaision. Like I said, it's usually been when there is a larger group of us.


This is nothing unique to Mexico, it happens all over the world, and likely far more often in poorer countries, naturally.

Caveat emptor.

Hi! I am home!!! Rain Rain go away take me back to Mexico......
Anyway this is the first thread I saw.....before this trip I would have had the same opinion...No big deal it happens anywhere....After this trip....No. The only negative experience of our trip (well besides an incident in Cozumel) was to do with bills at restaurants & beach clubs.

I do not buy the fact that there is a tax in Playa & that is what is being added to the bill. Maybe there is a tax but I don't think the extra $ is claimed or paid back to the gov't .....It is going in the servers pocket.

Some examples.

On one occasion we went to one of my fave (formerly) restaurants in Playa. My Mom was buying. We each ordered 1 drink each (40 pesos) & the kids & I had appetizers. My drink was wrong (although the waiter insisted it wasn't) no big deal I didn't make a scene Nick drank it. (It was tequila which makes me barf) & the food was mediocre. Fine could be an off night. Bill comes & my Mom grabs it & I overhear her say is 800 pesos enough? I say what? I look at the bill & add it up. In a big circle it says $687. Seems steep for what we ordered so I add it up twice & Nick does the same. We get $497. To make a long story short after we nicely ask the server about it he gets quite upset. He shoves a calculator at Nick which does indeed add up to what we thought. I pay. He gives me back the change. From $687. I say No and stand & wait. He says "What service not good?" Then he throws the change in my hand & slams the cash drawer shut. It still wasn't right & he got himself a $60 peso tip for being an arse but I was too intimidated to argue. If my Mom had paid he would have had a $320 tip. Nice.


Mothers Day I take Mom out. We order half order salads, kids order quesidillas, Nick has special. Bill comes it says $620 in a circle. Nothing added up. I say "excuse me but do you mind re-adding this". He says "$620". I say "No it is supossed to be $390. Only after I asked to see a menu & I added it up again he says "Sorry Sorry $390".
$230 is not a mistake.

Beach club: We get there & ask how much chairs are if we are buying food & having a couple drinks. "No problem it is free. No problem". Bill comes a the end. $120 for chairs. $100 a drink for my malibu & 7's. Said I ordered doubles. I did not order doubles. I was at the beach with my kids & Mom I was not ordering doubles. Beer was charged $10 over the menu. All of a sudden none of the 3 guys working could speak a word of English. I paid the bill. Overcharged about $200 (not counting the beach chairs) The rest of the time if we went there (only in the Evening) we ordered at the bar & paid drink by drink. The ladies there were very nice.
Another beach club. We were here a few times over our trip. The first time we ordered & paid drink by drink. Once we had that server a couple days we felt comfortable running a tab. He was very honest & we tipped him well! Our last day he was not working so we had a different server. Bill comes he says $420 & hands me a reciept that says $264. He says plus 2 pina colodas. This was our last day & I had been adding up on a notepad. I say it is supposed to be $324 & I only had 1 drink. He asks me what I have & says "Oh sorry $324".

Many times we noticed a scribble at the bottom of our bill with an amount written beside it. Usually 10%. We just asked if it was a "Propina". Yes it always was....which is fine no big deal. The issue is that I bet many people don't even notice. Essentially they are getting double tipped. One restaurant however told us it was to pay the kitchen staff.

These are examples of my experience. I love Playa. Getting hustled leaves a bad taste in my mouth though. I can't imagine how many times people are taken in a day & don't even realize it. Sure I am on vacation. I will wholeheartedly pay for what I order & tip well. I am not made of $ though & I can't afford to pay an extra $200 a meal. If that was the case I would order more booze.

I would like to mention a few places where the bill was spot on & tip was not included (or if it was it was CLEARLY marked as so):
Karma Bagel. (Ate here 4 times love it)
El Fogon.
HC
La Pesca
Carboncitos
Mamitas Beach Club (with the exception of one time)
Pizza Pazza (okay okay it is a pizza place hard to scam people but I love this place....be sure to put some $$ in their tip jar. We ate Pizza alot)
Paamul restaurant (Thanks for the reminder Susie!)
Luna Blue Bar

My advice is do not run a tab at a beach club. Write down everything you drink. Do not run a tab at the bar. Pay drink by drink at the bar. Ask if the Propina is included at restaurants. Have a rough idea of what your bill should be.

Many times this trip I overheard people say that "Mexico is getting more expensive"......This stuff is bad for business & I think it is in the restaurant & bar owners hands to make it right.

Melissa

[Heather]

I understand your frustration completely, Melissa. They must get away with it a lot to keep trying it. Like you, I am ALWAYS vigilant and keep meticulous track of my bills. It sucks that I have to be, though.

[barbj050]

i guess i will be waymore careful checking my tabs from now on...or stay a bit more sober.................

[Susie Q Roo]

Originally Posted by Tommygurl

I would like to mention a few places where the bill was spot on & tip was not included (or if it was it was CLEARLY marked as so):
Karma Bagel. (Ate here 4 times love it)
El Fogon.
HC
La Pesca
Carboncitos
Mamitas Beach Club (with the exception of one time)
Pizza Pazza (okay okay it is a pizza place hard to scam people but I love this place....be sure to put some $$ in their tip jar. We ate Pizza alot)
Luna Blue Bar

Don't forget Paamul!
Thanks for buying our lunch, too!

[SunKneeMarie]

Hi Melissa Grace! Welcome home!!

So sorry you had to deal with all of that, but I must ask... were those numbers off the top of your head, cuz you have one of those rainman memories with numbers, or did you scribble notes to yourself? Cuz those were some seriously specific figures you just rattled off

[Rissask]

Welcome home, Melissa! Missed you around here. Sorry about the bad experiences, it does leave a bad taste, I know.

[ryberg]

Originally Posted by Tommygurl

I do not buy the fact that there is a tax in Playa & that is what is being added to the bill. Maybe there is a tax but I don't think the extra $ is claimed or paid back to the gov't .....It is going in the servers pocket.

Well if you paid with a credit card, tax was absolutely paid on your bill, because anything that goes into the establishment's account (which of course would necessarily be the case with a credit card payment) is taxed as income. In Mexico, you don't get to tell the government, this part was income, this part wasn't. It's income, period, and the taxes apply to it as such.

(Conversely, the so-called cash "discounts" offered at some hotels and such are precisely what you're saying: proprietors don't report the income, there's no necessary deposit or paper trail, and so they don't pay the government the taxes they're supposed to.)

Unfortunately my sense is the the perception continues that if you go to Mexico, people are gonna try to rip you off.



Steve

[Heather]

Originally Posted by ryberg

Unfortunately my sense is the the perception continues that if you go to Mexico, people are gonna try to rip you off.



Steve

I don't see it as a perception if it's really happening here, though. And I don't think it's necessarily this way everywhere in Mexico, but it does get tried here in PdC.

[ryberg]

Originally Posted by Heather

I don't see it as a perception if it's really happening here, though. And I don't think it's necessarily this way everywhere in Mexico, but it does get tried here in PdC.

I've had people rather obviously try to cheat me out of chunks of change in Germany, Spain, Japan and, of course, the US, where I've had many more transactions where that could happen.

People are jumping to conclusions that someone must be trying to cheat them in circumstances where that seems far from obvious, if you ask me. That comment was one example: how do you know the tax is not being paid? I'll tell you that you can be sure the tax is not being paid when a place offers to not charge you that tax in the first place as long as you pay cash (an offer some of the same people complaining about such here might, ironically, be happy to take or even search out).

How do you know your local gas station is paying its taxes properly? Do you assume it isn't?

How do you know the last time you ate out in your hometown, that restaurant didn't try to pocket more of the money you paid than it's legally supposed to?

It gets tiring to hear the default assumption be that Mexicans and Mexican establishments are trying to cheat or trick people...

Steve

[SunKneeMarie]

I have the perception that everywhere I go people are possibly going to try and rip me off...

we paid cash at a hotel once in Tulsa and when Mike went to tell them something about the water in the bathroom as we were leaving the next morning, they had no record of us being in the room... clerk night before had apparently just pocketed the money...

restaurant in downtown Dallas tried to pad our bill with bar drinks--and we hadn't ordered anything at all from the bar...

roofing companies are knocking on my door every few days letting me know that I MUST HAVE roof damage, because they're replacing a roof the next street over and we had the same storm, right? and they can even "work it out" so that my deductible can be built in and I won't be out of pocket anything... yeah, that'll help the homeowners' insurance mess going on...

so while I like to think most people are inherently good, I also think there are a lot of people who are greedy and a quick buck is a quick buck... a quick peso is a quick peso... problem is it DOES cause me to not be so trusting when my bill comes to the table... wherever that table may be....

[Heather]

Originally Posted by ryberg

It gets tiring to hear the default assumption be that Mexicans and Mexican establishments are trying to cheat or trick people...

Steve

Are there assumptions here that Mexicans and Mexican establishments are trying to cheat or trick people? I've been reading about specific incidents where it did happen to these people, but also read about places where their bills were fine. I will have to go back and read this all more carefully because I would certainly not be happy if I found blanket assumptions about ALL Mexicans or ALL Mexican establishments.

[Tommygurl]

Originally Posted by ryberg

Well if you paid with a credit card, tax was absolutely paid on your bill, because anything that goes into the establishment's account (which of course would necessarily be the case with a credit card payment) is taxed as income. In Mexico, you don't get to tell the government, this part was income, this part wasn't. It's income, period, and the taxes apply to it as such.

(Conversely, the so-called cash "discounts" offered at some hotels and such are precisely what you're saying: proprietors don't report the income, there's no necessary deposit or paper trail, and so they don't pay the government the taxes they're supposed to.)

Unfortunately my sense is the the perception continues that if you go to Mexico, people are gonna try to rip you off.



Steve

Steve I paid cash. Thank you.
I am a tourist. The fact that you seem to care less about my opinion as a tourist explains things.
No problem if there is a tax. I will gladly pay tax.
If it is a tax why then is the server calling it a "propina". Why would the server tell me it is a tip when it is really a tax that the business owner would pay? Makes no sense to me. Then they would have no tip. No logic there.

Furthermore I am confused about your arguement. How does having $200 pesos added onto a $500 bill have anything to do with tax?????? What is the exact tax on food please so I can be clear.