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Old 11-07-2008   #61 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by melliedee View Post
Actually, I think the worst stuff came from conservative dissenters in one damning op ed after another listing Palin as the demise of the ticket. Kos played dirty with family gossip, but those GOP defectors did the most significant damage by speaking the truth about the impact of her selection.

Who reads the Daily Koz? About the only time I read it is every few months when someone here (usually from the right) links to it.

I seriously doubt it has much of an effect on anyone or anything.
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Old 11-07-2008   #62 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by kirbyfan View Post
It was a bad choice IMO as she clearly wasnt ready for that role.

Your not kidding!

Why would you find it frightening that she was embraced? Shes a charismatic woman and speaker, those types are usually quite popular with the rest of humanity.


I thought that was obvious; because she hasn't a clue about world politics or current affairs etc. I find it frightening that such a person can be embraced in any respect a suitable for high office.


McCain's people IMO did far more damage to his campaign than Palin could ever have. What exactly are the "measures of Presidential merit" I'd like to take the test and see if I qualify for a merit badge!


Competance, astuteness, intelligence, a strong grasp of domestic and foreign political issues .. I could go on. The point is Palin could not demonstrate them which is what is so scary of her choice as Vice President.


I would ask any comedian/satirist in the world but they are busy brushing up on their Obama material. Do you really think a good example of how to test this theory is to "ask a comedian"??? They have made fun of every single President and most politicians since the dawn of time in case you hadnt noticed.


I think you missed the point; GW was ridiculed and parodied for being dumb! Seriously he writes his own material - look up his gaffes - they are hilarious.

I hated some leaders and/or the politics of some leaders.
Whether I liked them or not they were all articulate and astute.
I don't like Dick Cheney but he isn't dumb..
This cannot be said of GW


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I believe it hursts the US when bumbling Bush inarticulates his position over and over again.
(If you disagree then just think of any comedian/satirist in the world and how they immitate Bush - now ask youself aren't you embarrassed?).

All very debatable...glad you are relying on "bits" as your measuring stick.

Does anyone condsider Bush to be articulate - seriously?
I saw more enough of Palin to see how unsuitable she was.
I believe many would agree.


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Ok so she can wink, smile and fake a demeanour/language to appeal to 'Mr six pack, love yer, I'm your bestest mate, I can't pay my phone bill too....blah).
What a stupid statement. Its not even worth a reply.

I think it is very accurate. In fact she was a one-trick ponyette and being 'folksy' was it.



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There must be far more astute and intelligent women out there who could make a real difference (I can find them looking no further than this board).
Ridiculous suck up statement...

It's not ridiculous. What is ridiculous about it?
You think Plain was that astute intelligent leader?



I hope we (conservatives) have a better candidate than John McCain or Bob Dole for President to pick from next time. I dont care if its a man or woman, what the color of their skins is or if they are beautiful and like to wink.

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Old 11-07-2008   #63 (permalink)
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Well it's hardly news on this thread to say you agree with Blueton's assessment, there. On the other hand it's rare that I' here saying I agree with Blueton's assessment of something, it seems. So, sorry KF, but I also think that pretty much hits the nail on the head.

I think Melliedee's follow on question highlights a very valid point, as well, despite your joking reply to it. Many have said similar things and I remember a post from Anna sveral months ago on it, too, remarking that we would certainly want for example the best educated doctor taking care of us and so forth.

I believe she was responding to the "elitist" charges being bandied about against Obama and others who might fit the bill at the time. I think there's a significant anti-elite, anti-intellectual current in especially the more religious base on the right, and that base of course was the one so energized by Palin and who drove her further support and popularity.

That is to say that I think you can respond by saying that attractive personality and understanding of issues are not mutually exclusive, but I think it's sort of wilfully disguising the reality that an important percentage of her supporters are themselves wilfully overlooking her failings in the latter. Hard to explain otherwise their failure to recoil -- in fact their rush to defend her -- when she tried to claim she understood foreign policy and security issues because she lives in Alaska, despite the inability to comment on major international issues, or the various other blunders of that type that she made.

Don't you think?

Steve

I think you would find that politically we agree about more than you might think. Our disagreements have nearly always been about balance and tone.
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Old 11-07-2008   #64 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by blueton View Post
I think you would find that politically we agree about more than you might think. Our disagreements have nearly always been about balance and tone.
Yes, I'm aware of that.

Steve
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Old 11-07-2008   #65 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by BonnyW View Post
She will go back to Alaska, and we will not see her much more after that.

I wonder what will happen with all the clothes she bought...?
I read in the news that the RNC would be sending folks to Alaska to do an inventory.
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Old 11-07-2008   #66 (permalink)
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Who reads the Daily Koz? About the only time I read it is every few months when someone here (usually from the right) links to it.

I seriously doubt it has much of an effect on anyone or anything.
All good points, at least from my perspective.

I don't know, maybe there are more rabid or extreme liberal netroots types who are for DailyKOS the equivalent of Rush Limbaugh's "Dittohead" army. But if there are many of those, I don't know where they're hiding...

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Old 11-07-2008   #67 (permalink)
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I read in the news that the RNC would be sending folks to Alaska to do an inventory.
Ya wanna bet on whether any more items will be "lost?" How does someone lose their clothing, exactly?
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Old 11-07-2008   #68 (permalink)
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All good points, at least from my perspective.

I don't know, maybe there are more rabid or extreme liberal netroots types who are for DailyKOS the equivalent of Rush Limbaugh's "Dittohead" army. But if there are many of those, I don't know where they're hiding...

Steve
I guess if you wanted your opinions reinforced and you were a liberal, you might read it.

The way I usually hear about is when someone from the right reads it to reinforce their opinions of liberals. I suspect it has a negligible effect on anyone's vote.
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Old 11-07-2008   #69 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Susie Q Roo View Post
Ya wanna bet on whether any more items will be "lost?" How does someone lose their clothing, exactly?

I want to come out pro on this issue.

I am in favor of people losing their clothing.
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Old 11-07-2008   #70 (permalink)
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I guess if you wanted your opinions reinforced and you were a liberal, you might read it.

The way I usually hear about is when someone from the right reads it to reinforce their opinions of liberals. I suspect it has a negligible effect on anyone's vote.
That's my impression, too. That's one reason I don't read it, and also almost never watch MSNBC, and don't put too much weight on anything I see on HuffPo unless it's corroborated elsewhere.

That's my impression of what conservatives do when they watch Fox, too. The more they defend it as "fair and balanced," the more I think they're missing the whole point of it.

I tend to put the most weight on commentary and analysis by some of those always intelligent and insightful conservatives I don't necessarily always agree with, like George Will, David Brooks and my personal fave, David Gergen.

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Old 11-07-2008   #71 (permalink)
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He sees only one use for it in the "reading room," and it ain't reading!

True. What was Brooks' line about being a [something] cancer on the party? Or Kathleen Parker's calls for her to voluntary leave the ticket? Did Colin Powell also comment on that choice in passing? Can't remember...

But then if they said those things, I guess they can't be conservatives, right?

Thus we see the incredible shrinking conservative base.

Steve
And those who only mentioned it in passing could not have been more emphatic...


"And finally, not to belabor it, there was the Palin nomination. What on earth can he have been thinking?"

-Christopher Buckley


"3. Two words: President Palin."

-Andrew Sullivan (that's from a top ten list why conservatives should vote for Obama)

"His campaign has been about glib answers to complex problems. His choice for vice president was political malpractice"

-Ron Wilcox
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Old 11-07-2008   #72 (permalink)
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That's my impression, too. That's one reason I don't read it, and also almost never watch MSNBC, and don't put too much weight on anything I see on HuffPo unless it's corroborated elsewhere.

That's my impression of what conservatives do when they watch Fox, too. The more they defend it as "fair and balanced," the more I think they're missing the whole point of it.

I tend to put the most weight on commentary and analysis by some of those always intelligent and insightful conservatives I don't necessarily always agree with, like George Will, David Brooks and my personal fave, David Gergen.

Steve
I saw George Will on Charlie Rose a few months ago. To the Palin wing of the Republican party he must seem like a flaming liberal. I agreed with a number of his positions regarding foreign policy.

It is a great shame that the GOP is still in in its anti-intellectual phase.It seems like it used to do this for mere marketing reasons. Now they seem to embrace it in people like Palin and that guy they elected President who is supposedly from Texas.
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Old 11-07-2008   #73 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Just Lucky View Post
I saw George Will on Charlie Rose a few months ago. To the Palin wing of the Republican party he must seem like a flaming liberal. I agreed with a number of his positions regarding foreign policy.

It is a great shame that the GOP is still in in its anti-intellectual phase.It seems like it used to do this for mere marketing reasons. Now they seem to embrace it in people like Palin and that guy they elected President who is supposedly from Texas.
Robert Novak wrote a blog about Gingrich in 2012.

He'll be a contender, you betcha.

He would not pick Palin.
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Old 11-07-2008   #74 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by melliedee View Post
"political malpractice"
I love it!
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Old 11-07-2008   #75 (permalink)
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I love it!
I prefer, "His campaign has been about glib answers to complex problems."

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