US Soldier guilty

[Uno]

Originally Posted by MaripositaII

Was that the reason we went in?

I thought Dubya was after WMDs. I don't recall the purpose being to stop genocide. Maybe I missed out on that part of the news?

No... We went in IMHO Because "He tried ta kill my daddy!" But genocide was the way. And would return in an instant.

Vietnam
Cambodia
Iraq
Afghanistan
Serbia
Kosovo
Africa

History has shown those exterminations we were NOT involved in were far worse.

[MaripositaII]

Originally Posted by UnoMasMezcal

No... We went in IMHO Because "He tried ta kill my daddy!" But genocide was the way. And would return in an instant.

Vietnam
Cambodia
Iraq
Afghanistan
Serbia
Kosovo
Africa

History has shown those exterminations we were NOT involved in were far worse.

Don't start me on why we were in Viet Nam. My neighbour's husband died a few years ago from whatever the hell they had used over there. That poor man suffered all his life His widow lives alone and we do what we can to help her through the holidays. I don't get war...neither side comes out winning in my opinion.

[Guitar Playa]

Originally Posted by TJordan

Our soldiers are off defending our country from our enemies.
These are amazing men and women who are doing that.

They do as they are ordered and never look back.


Our freedom?
Maybe they're not, but they sure as hell are fighting for the safety of our country, and I'm not talking about just Iraq, either.

Do not get me wrong I am pretty much a stand behind your Military or you are welcome to stand in front of them kind of guy.

I am sorry to tell you, but if the US government was concerned about your safety they wouldn't have started the sh*t storm in Iraq in the first place. They would have consintrated their troops on the Afgan/Pakastan borders.

It has been already proven that Iraq did not have weapons of mass destruction nor where they a terrorist haven (see Iran and Pakastan) so really in no way a threat to the American people.

It just about the control of oil in the region plain and simple.

If the government at the time was serious about slamming down the terrorist factions they would have tried harder to cut back on the purchase of foriegn oil but they decided to go in the complete opposite direction as most of them had a stake in the oil game.

To go to war to defend your country from invading forces and stop mass genocide of the innocent, sure.
Too secure natural resources in another country for your own country's benefit hmmmm. I think our military could be put to better use than that.
Why did we not go into Africa....cause they have nice happy agreement with the warlords in the Congo who control the mines.

[MaripositaII]

Originally Posted by Guitar Playa

Do not get me wrong I am pretty much a stand behind your Military or you are welcome to stand in front of them kind of guy.

I am sorry to tell you, but if the US government was concerned about your safety they wouldn't have started the sh*t storm in Iraq in the first place. They would have consintrated their troops on the Afgan/Pakastan borders.

It has been already proven that Iraq did not have weapons of mass destruction nor where they a terrorist haven (see Iran and Pakastan) so really in no way a threat to the American people.

It just about the control of oil in the region plain and simple.

If the government at the time was serious about slamming down the terrorist factions they would have tried harder to cut back on the purchase of foriegn oil but they decided to go in the complete opposite direction as most of them had a stake in the oil game.

To go to war to defend your country from invading forces and stop mass genocide of the innocent, sure.
Too secure natural resources in another country for your own country's benefit hmmmm. I think our military could be put to better use than that.
Why did we not go into Africa....cause they have nice happy agreement with the warlords in the Congo who control the mines.

Excellent post! Thank you.

[Uno]

Originally Posted by MaripositaII

Excellent post! Thank you.

I can't disagree with either of you. BUT What the hell you we do now? Turn our people against our own troops because we disagree with why / how they got there? Are you willing to tell a combat vet he/she fought for nothing?

We owe it to them to create something positive in the end. Peace in the region. I don't know how, but something.

[MaripositaII]

Originally Posted by UnoMasMezcal

I can't disagree with either of you. BUT What the hell you we do now? Turn our people against our own troops because we disagree with why / how they got there? Are you willing to tell a combat vet he/she fought for nothing?

We owe it to them to create something positive in the end. Peace in the region. I don't know how, but something.

My BIL has been in the military for ages. Remember Desert Storm? I will never forget what he said upon his return. What a @#$%& waste of time that was. We made a fuss when he got back home. Had a huge party for him, but he didn't feel like a hero. He felt like he failed somehow, and he absolutely hated Bush. They went for a reason and came back empty handed is how he saw it.

Now he's in Iraq...same feelings. He keeps asking, "what the @#$% is all of this about?" I hope he comes back as he was sent, but we fear for his mental state. It's been too long...

[Uno]

Originally Posted by MaripositaII

My BIL has been in the military for ages. Remember Desert Storm? I will never forget what he said upon his return. What a @#$%& waste of time that was. We made a fuss when he got back home. Had a huge party for him, but he didn't feel like a hero. He felt like he failed somehow, and he absolutely hated Bush. They went for a reason and came back empty handed is how he saw it.

Now he's in Iraq...same feelings. He keeps asking, "what the @#$% is all of this about?" I hope he comes back as he was sent, but we fear for his mental state. It's been too long...

It HAS been too long. That brings us full circle to my original opinion that it's wrong to convict that soldier for murder.

[MaripositaII]

Originally Posted by UnoMasMezcal

It HAS been too long. That brings us full circle to my original opinion that it's wrong to convict that soldier for murder.

Tell that to the military. They have rules, and I am sure the soldiers know what the rules are. But as I said at the beginning, it's war and who knows what happens to their minds.

No one wins these wars, even though that jackace Dubya claimed we were winning... wtf is winning? Casualties on both sides, that's winning? Billions of dollars down the toilet? Body bags every week? That's winning?

[Uno]

Originally Posted by MaripositaII

Tell that to the military. They have rules, and I am sure the soldiers know what the rules are. But as I said at the beginning, it's war and who knows what happens to their minds.

No one wins these wars, even though that jackace Dubya claimed we were winning... wtf is winning? Casualties on both sides, that's winning? Billions of dollars down the toilet? Body bags every week? That's winning?

And here we are. One in support, one not. No way to agree. So how do we end it? Both sides just walk away? I still haven't heard any resolve. Seems I never do. What is the answer I ask. Not that we shouldn't have ever gotten here. (I agree) But that doesn't change the present. And who's side will you take if genocide returns? The: we must help side, or the: Stay out and let them die side?

[MaripositaII]

Originally Posted by UnoMasMezcal

And here we are. One in support, one not. No way to agree. So how do we end it? Both sides just walk away? I still haven't heard any resolve. Seems I never do. What is the answer I ask. Not that we shouldn't have ever gotten here. (I agree) But that doesn't change the present. And who's side will you take if genocide returns? The: we must help side, or the: Stay out and let them die side?

That's not the only country with genocide my friend. Why pick that one?

[Sr.Yason]

Originally Posted by MaripositaII

Was that the reason we went in?

I thought Dubya was after WMDs. I don't recall the purpose being to stop genocide. Maybe I missed out on that part of the news?

I think you actually missed th pictures of the north Iraqi's that were murdered by Saddam by using poisons gas, this include women and children and left their dead in the streets. I bet they think the war came a bit!!!!!

[Uno]

Originally Posted by MaripositaII

That's not the only country with genocide my friend. Why pick that one?

I agree with that as well. I never understood Rwanda. How can we pick one and not the other. (I already know the answer by the way) It's about regions, politics, and political gain) But still no answer to my question. How to get out? And what future stance to take in the region? Oh sorry. That's 2 questions. But one answer will suffice.

[Uno]

Mari? Are you thinking?

You know I luv ya. Remember. 2 cases of beer for me, and a shopping spree for you!

[Uno]

Originally Posted by Sr.Yason

I think you actually missed th pictures of the north Iraqi's that were murdered by Saddam by using poisons gas, this include women and children and left their dead in the streets. I bet they think the war came a bit!!!!!

And thank you. That doesn't seem to ever come up. Does it?

[Guitar Playa]

Originally Posted by UnoMasMezcal

I can't disagree with either of you. BUT What the hell you we do now? Turn our people against our own troops because we disagree with why / how they got there? Are you willing to tell a combat vet he/she fought for nothing?

We owe it to them to create something positive in the end. Peace in the region. I don't know how, but something.

Absolutely agree with you. It will take a miracle to get this turned around.
Everyone is just clammering for control. and if we did pick up and leave, dear lord the amount of dead that would be piling up.

Just not a good formula no matter how you strategically play it.
In the mean time our boys and girls wake up everyday over there and deal with it.
It's hard thing what war does to a person and for that very reason alone our vets deserve our utmost respect (and service).

On the other end of the gun.....My mother and I befriended a family who were Albainian refugees from Serbia.
The stories the children would tell made my jaw drop and left me with a deep sadness for what they must have went through.

....It's hard thing what war does to a person.

So getting back to the original topic. Can't judge.
....It's hard thing what war does to a person.