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Old 01-18-2011   #61 (permalink)
Sol
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Babaloo View Post
Yep. A different account.
I wonder if the preliminary information (about attacking each other) came from local authorities or witnesses.
Statement from the Mexican Embassy.

Same here, who is providing information about this?
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Old 01-18-2011   #62 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by BeSafe View Post
Mexico is a dangerous country to travel to period! Hundreds of U.S. and Canadian citizens are either raped, robbed or killed in Mexico every year. A shocking 32% of all non-natural deaths of U.S. citizen’s outside this country occur in Mexico. Many of these deaths happen inside of the resorts and are a direct result of poor or nonexistent safety standards. To read tragic Mexico vacation death stories, as well as stories written by victims that “survived” their Mexico vacation, go to:
http://www.mexicovacationawareness.com
Newsflash!... Thousands of U.S. and Canadian citizens are robbed, raped or killed in the U.S. and Canada every year. It's no surprise that such a high percentage of deaths outside the U.S. happen in Mexico, because more people visit Mexico than any other country! Statistics are fun.

I don't personally see how your post relates to the topic of this thread (try blaming this incident on poor and non-existent safety standards at resorts).

You're either trolling or using this forum to advertise your website (or both). Neither is very polite.
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Old 01-18-2011   #63 (permalink)
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That is odd that the story changed again....but that happens, when the media only gets bits and pieces at a time....hopefully in a few days there will be more of a complete story available.


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Originally Posted by Heather View Post
I did not mean to discount the seriousness of these allegations and fervently hope a thorough, honest investigation is conducted.
Same here.

In my defense, I was sidedtracked by Minjm asking why 'so many Canadians SEEM to be involved in incidents in Mexico"...I was trying to address that, since I think it was an interesting question.....I am sorry if I offended anyone.


A story like this one is actually more concerning to me, as it has to do with a totally innocent bystander. There has been a few stories like that involving tourists hit by stray bullets, but none in the Yucatan that I am aware of....so at least there is that.
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Old 01-18-2011   #64 (permalink)
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Maggie..I saw your stats of Canadian visitors VS US vistors. I don't know the stats on legnth of visits, but it seems alot of Canadians tend to stay alot longer than the usual 3 nights to a week like many Americans do. Last trip, every Canadian I met was there for more than a month..granted, most were retired escaping the cold dreary north.
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Old 01-18-2011   #65 (permalink)
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I don't know. There may be things about the story that cause people to believe that this couple is not telling the truth, however...I will never feel comfortable saying that a woman is lying about being a rape victim, only based on my perception of the story that is being told.
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Old 01-19-2011   #66 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Sol View Post
This is awful. The images of Rebecca Rutland in a hospital/clinic are haunting.

Mexico's ambassador to Canada is Francisco J. Barrio Terrazas. He was the governor of Chihuahua from 1992-2000(?). During his tenure as governor, over three hundred women disappeared and/or were murdered in Ciudad Juarez. The majority of them were young women who were assembly plant workers. When confronted with this, he indicated that it was their fault because they were out late at night and/or because of the way they dressed. Even though several organizations protested his indifference towards this issue, Barrio Terrazas refused to investigate the matter. It will be interesting to see how much pressure he puts into the officials in the Mexican government to conduct an investigation of Rebecca Rutland's rape.

wow
this is terrible news
i wish it were not so

but i don't think it would make a big difference
we will never know what really happened
i have doubts about both sides here

it could have been avoided so easily
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Old 01-19-2011   #67 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Y2YTraveller View Post
I have read the story a few times and my inclination is to disbelieve the allegations for the following reasons:

1) Hubby's story is entirely lacking in credibility; it is bizarre and implausible and internally inconsistent.
2) False allegations of rape & sexual assault are not at all uncommon; secondary gain, whether it be the prospect of financial compensation or something more complex, is an extremely powerful motivator. False sex assault claims are especially problematic because they are extremely difficult to disprove and they frequently result in some type of "reward" to the complainant. For example, they are an all-too frequent feature of many divorce and custody disputes, with studies suggesting the rate of false accusations may be as high as 50% in that context.
3) Absence of physical evidence - a negative rape kit test implies that either the alleged rape lacked physical roughness (which would be inconsistent with the bruising and alleged bite marks), or that the alleged attacker wore a condom, which certainly seems quite inconsistent with the rest of the victim's story. I note that the CBC's "expert" on that point is a nurse-clinician and victims' advocate with no forensic training whatsoever
4) The fact that the only major Canadian news outlet to pick this story up so far is the CBC, which has a history of running with stories which turn out to have no "legs", certainly raises a red flag for a lot of people.
5) Finally, the alleged victim's demeanour doesn't quite fit. Genuine victims of rape, especially those who have suffered at the hands of authority figures, tend to be fearful & withdrawn to shun attention and publicity, often having to be carefully encouraged and supported in order to find the strength to confront their attackers and engage the justice system. This woman displays quite the opposite demeanour. While this factor in isolation probably doesn't mean much, when combined with the other inconsistencies in the story, it is definitely problematic.

None of the above conclusively rules out the possibility that these allegations are true or partly true, however the preponderance of implausibility strongly suggests that they are either fabricated or grossly exaggerated. Certainly, no court in Canada would convict on evidence as flimsy as this.

Therefore, unless some corroboration arises, I remain unconvinced.
You make some good points, but I must say the jury is out. Further the information in media is limited, riddled with holes and sometimes inaccurate.

But may I add this:

It will depend on many factors including whether the lady had a shower after the alleged events and attending to the hospital or for a rape kit. What I find interesting is the focus on the lack of evidence from the rape kit and no mention of DNA in relation to bite marks! Think of this: if one is bitten, there may be DNA from Saliva adding validity to either the version of the police or this couple. Also depending on the bite marks and their impressions the fiancee may be ruled out or identified, and others, such as police, may be ruled out or identified.

The video in the cell may not have been working, but how would the lady know that and was the camera visible?

While the video in the room of the alleged rape may not have worked what about the video (if any) from Playa and the rest of the police station?

Just because it is a CBC report means nothing.

Finally there is no "typical" reaction to rape. I don't think you can draw much from that. That said the story is VERY bizarre.

It is funny because after moving to Canada I advised Canadians going to Mexico to be careful but enjoy and they thought I was nuts. Now that I am taking my children to Playa they think I am nuts and Mexico is VERY dangerous. Well I do not see Mexico having changed that much, except drug war in certain areas (not Playa) and that I still feel safer in Playa than Detroit or LA.

I hope this gets sorted out and proof is conslusive one way or another, but I do not see this happening.
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Old 01-19-2011   #68 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by LostInCanada View Post
You make some good points, but I must say the jury is out. Further the information in media is limited, riddled with holes and sometimes inaccurate.

But may I add this:

It will depend on many factors including whether the lady had a shower after the alleged events and attending to the hospital or for a rape kit. What I find interesting is the focus on the lack of evidence from the rape kit and no mention of DNA in relation to bite marks! Think of this: if one is bitten, there may be DNA from Saliva adding validity to either the version of the police or this couple. Also depending on the bite marks and their impressions the fiancee may be ruled out or identified, and others, such as police, may be ruled out or identified.

...
Very good point- the photos in the news story were consistent with bite marks, although I couldn't tell from whether there were any teeth marks. Of course, that establishes nothing as to the source of her injuries, and DNA testing takes several weeks at a minimum even in Canada - if the assault occurred New Year's Eve, the DNA results wouldn't likely be known until early February at the earliest.

What really troubles me most about this story as reported thus far is the lack of physical evidence, shower or no shower. While it's certainly possible, for example, that a victim could be raped at gunpoint or while passed out without leaving any trace of physical trauma in the pubic region, this particular victim is describing a violent incident which she says resulted in extensive bruising and bite marks, with two perpetrators involved. Given that she made her way to hospital fairly soon after the alleged assault, any such trauma would have been evident and likely recorded at that time. That, of course, doesn't rule out incompetence or corruption on the part of hospital officials, but that's entirely speculative.

I agree that her incongruent demeanour doesn't mean much in isolation as any comparison will be a broad generalisation at best. However, in combination with the other inconsistencies and implausibilities in her story, it becomes significant. Were it not for those other holes in her story, her demeanour alone would not cause me to disbelieve her allegations.

One point that needs to be made: either this woman is (mostly) telling the truth and is the victim of a horrific crime and breach of trust, or she's fabricating the incident and is therefore likely a deeply disturbed individual. Either way, she is in need of help.
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Old 01-19-2011   #69 (permalink)
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I would encourage RCMP investigators to question this couple, as they have now returned to Canada.

Last edited by Bryzee; 01-19-2011 at 07:02 AM..
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Old 01-19-2011   #70 (permalink)
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Am I the only one that found it extremely odd of the "victim" to be interviewed wearing a Mexican blouse? It sure looks a lot like those available for sale in the area. Does she wish to remind herself of her vacation to Mexico?

It's interesting that some have locked onto this as if they know it was fact. How so? For those buying into this story 100%, remember balloon boy? To thine own self be true - when you first heard the story of that child floating away, did you believe it?

Count me as a skeptic. They don't display the demeanor of victims of assault & rape. Whoever is lying should be punished, and punished severely.

Last edited by Sogno; 01-19-2011 at 07:32 AM..
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Old 01-19-2011   #71 (permalink)
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I think the reason Canadian tourists are more often victims, if that statistic is true, is because they are the majority of tourists there. (my anecdotal evidence) We just came back from PDC and met lots of Canadians, some Europeans, and very few fellow Americans.
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Old 01-19-2011   #72 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by hooterville_mom View Post
I think the reason Canadian tourists are more often victims, if that statistic is true, is because they are the majority of tourists there. (my anecdotal evidence) We just came back from PDC and met lots of Canadians, some Europeans, and very few fellow Americans.
...........must be based on your scientific eveidence.
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Old 01-19-2011   #73 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Sogno View Post
Am I the only one that found it extremely odd of the "victim" to be interviewed wearing a Mexican blouse? It sure looks a lot like those available for sale in the area. Does she wish to remind herself of her vacation to Mexico?

It's interesting that some have locked onto this as if they know it was fact. How so? For those buying into this story 100%, remember balloon boy? To thine own self be true - when you first heard the story of that child floating away, did you believe it?

Count me as a skeptic. They don't display the demeanor of victims of assault & rape. Whoever is lying should be punished, and punished severely.
What the heck does her wearing a Mexican blouse have to do with anything?
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Old 01-19-2011   #74 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Sue View Post
I don't know. There may be things about the story that cause people to believe that this couple is not telling the truth, however...I will never feel comfortable saying that a woman is lying about being a rape victim, only based on my perception of the story that is being told.
Didn't you post awhile back that photos were taken of her at the hospital and shown in the original article? Did anyone ever respond to you about this?



I had to have missed something. Why was the woman taken into custody? Were they both drunk and disorderly? Or just the husband?
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Old 01-19-2011   #75 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Luv2Dance View Post
What the heck does her wearing a Mexican blouse have to do with anything?
If you don't understand the significance, I doubt that you'd understand the explanation.
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