Self-tour of Cozumel?

[JenLN]

If I'm staying in PDC and my hotel rents out snorkeling gear, can I take that on the ferry to Cozumel and use it there?

I was planning to go to Chankanaab, but the Cozumel Marine Park looks nice, too. But I'm not sure if you can snorkel there, maybe scuba only. Any recommendations? Difference in price? I think I've seen the Chankanaab Park listed at about $10 US and the Marine Park at 20 pesos. How far are either of these from the ferry port? (I've heard $5-10 cab ride to Chankanaab, but nothing about Cozumel Marine Park.) Any other good CHEAP attractions within 30 minutes walking distance of the port and/or either park?

Another random question, for "excuse me", I've always said compermiso, but I've read that it's permite. I'm sure there are variations in dialect, what is appropriate for the PDC area?

[bagoman]

Jen, We do the bar crawl around Cozumel every year. Rent a car and make a day of it. We have never had a problem renting gear along the way at different bars and hotels. It sure beats lugging it around with you all day. It gets cumbersome after awhile. The rental car (usually a VW bug or jeep) costs about the same as a cab ride $30-50 for the day, and we can go where we want. There are some very cool bars once you get out of town, Bob Marleys Bar, Coconuts, and my personal favorite, Mescalitos. The conch in garlic is to die for.

[tommy]

JenLN -yes you can...chankanaab is $10 cab ride and $10 entrance fee...pretty good snorkeling....lots of shops around ferry pier...have not been to marine park...if you do rent a car you will be able to go to all the different beach's...what ever you decide im sure you will enjoy.

[Fudge_Brownie]

All good suggestions from the above sources. Cozumel has many snorkeling locations, We spent a great deal of time lurking on one of the three Cozumel forums and came to the conclusion that the two tourist destinations Dzul-Ha and Chankanaab were suffering from a bit of overuse. We decided on the Corona Beach Club which is adjacent to Chankanaab.

I found Cozumel interesting, the port area was awash with tourist retail establishments, a good day trip but I would not make a return visit. Playa is much more interesting.

[JenLN]

I guess I'll just have to see how adventurous the people I'm traveling with would like to be....thanks!

[ELECTRA]

Originally Posted by JenLN

Another random question, for "excuse me", I've always said compermiso, but I've read that it's permite. I'm sure there are variations in dialect, what is appropriate for the PDC area?

I keep hearing about "dialects". This is not Italy there are NO Dialects of Spanish. If you want to say "excuse me" you have several choices (note the spelling):

"Con Permiso" = which is more or less "may I", or "do you mind (if I...)"

"Perdoname" = Pardon me

"Perdona" = Pardon / Excuse me

You could be refering to variations in PRONUNCIATION but the language does NOT change.

[JenLN]

Sorry, I was guessing about there being dialects...and I learned much of my Spanish from working in restaurants, so I know how things sound, not how they're spelled. Thanks for clearing that up for me, though.

(I also know a lot of profane slang, which I should probably keep to myself down there)

[denisea]

Originally Posted by JenLN

Sorry, I was guessing about there being dialects...and I learned much of my Spanish from working in restaurants, so I know how things sound, not how they're spelled. Thanks for clearing that up for me, though.

(I also know a lot of profane slang, which I should probably keep to myself down there)

Actually, JenLN you are correct. Unfortunately, it is Electra who is misinformed. There most certainly are dialects of Spanish. The 4 major dialects Spanish dialects being: Castilian, Latin American, Trade Winds, and Argentinian.

Latin American Spanish:

This is the dialect that is spoken in Mexico, Colombia, Peru, and Bolivia, though each country has it’s own accents. You may also find it referred to as "Highland" Spanish because it’s generally spoken in the mountainous areas of Latin America. This dialect was derived from the Castilian Spanish that was spoken in Spain during the sixteenth and seventeenth centuries and brought to the Americas by the early colonists. It is also the most common Spanish dialect taught in the U.S.

Phonology unique to Latin American Spanish:

Each letter is pronounced.

Strong r sounds are used.

The s sound is used instead of the Castilian lisplike th sound (z or c before e or i in spelling). For example, in Latin American Spanish gracias (thank you) is gras-see-as as opposed to gratheas in Castilian Spanish.

The ll is pronounced with a y sound or even with the zh sound of the z in English azure or the j in French jour instead of the Castilian ly sound.

The word ustedes is used as the formal form of you instead of the Castilian vosotros.

Of course, Mexican Spanish also has it's own dialects that differ in several points of phonology from region to region.

The Yucatán peninsula and areas that border Guatemala are similar to the dialects of Central America (the southern state of Chiapas, for example, was originally part of the Audiencia of Guatemala and only became part of Mexico after the wars of colonial independence).

The Caribbean coastal region of Yucatán, particularly the areas of Veracruz and Tabasco, exhibits more Caribbean phonetic traits found in Andalusian and Canary Island Spanish than that spoken in the remainder of Mexico.

The Mexico City area has a dialect that is more like the traditional dialects spoken by government officials in Madrid due to the Northern Spaniards who emigrated to this area during colonial times.

Now back to the original question... how does one say "excuse me" or "pardon me" in Mexico:

con permiso is used as excuse me when you need to get past someone.

¡por favor! (pronounced por fabor) is used as excuse me when you need to get someone's attention.

disculpe (pronounced deeskoolpeh) is used as excuse me when you need to say you are sorry to someone.

¿mande? (pronounced mandeh) is used as pardon me when you didn't understand or hear something that someone said.

[JenLN]

thanks for all the info, much appreciated.

[ELECTRA]

Originally Posted by denisea

Actually, JenLN you are correct. Unfortunately, it is Electra who is misinformed. There most certainly are dialects of Spanish. The 4 major dialects Spanish dialects being: Castilian, Latin American, Trade Winds, and Argentinian..[/indent]

Wrong; Denisea I have revised/studied/read/memorized, more then I would have wanted the Spanish language, its changes throughout history etc. I hold several language degrees and one of them happens to be in.....Spanish.
Castilliano IS Spanish BTW

Originally Posted by denisea

Latin American Spanish:

This is the dialect that is spoken in Mexico, Colombia, Peru, and Bolivia, though each country has it’s own accents. [/indent]

TRUE they all have different accents but are NOT Dialects

Originally Posted by denisea

Phonology unique to Latin American Spanish:

Each letter is pronounced.

Strong r sounds are used.

The s sound is used instead of the Castilian lisplike th sound (z or c before e or i in spelling). For example, in Latin American Spanish gracias (thank you) is gras-see-as as opposed to gratheas in Castilian Spanish.

Again, just a change in pronounciation. But not "Unique"

Originally Posted by denisea

The ll is pronounced with a y sound or even with the zh sound of the z in English azure or the j in French jour instead of the Castilian ly sound. [/indent]

Again, just a change in pronounciation.

Originally Posted by denisea

The word ustedes is used as the formal form of you instead of the Castilian vosotros. [/indent]

Usted IS the formal in Spanish/Castellano. (Third person plural/ Formal). The second person plural (Vosotros) is INformal is Spanish. Beacause it is not used in some parts of the Spanish speaking world does not make it a dialect. It is Still Spanish

Originally Posted by denisea

Of course, Mexican Spanish also has it's own dialects that differ in several points of phonology from region to region.[/indent]

Have you ever traveled north to south in Spain, England? The US????? They are NOT dialects but rather regional Colloquialisms, accents. The language is still the language in question.

Originally Posted by denisea

The Yucatán peninsula and areas that border Guatemala are similar to the dialects of Central America (the southern state of Chiapas, for example, was originally part of the Audiencia of Guatemala and only became part of Mexico after the wars of colonial independence).

TRUE they all have different accents but are NOT Dialects. they have their own unique words perhaps as many languages do within itself. Colloquialisms, accents etc.

Originally Posted by denisea

The Caribbean coastal region of Yucatán, particularly the areas of Veracruz and Tabasco, exhibits more Caribbean phonetic traits found in Andalusian and Canary Island Spanish than that spoken in the remainder of Mexico.

TRUE they all have different accents but are NOT Dialects.

Originally Posted by denisea

The Mexico City area has a dialect that is more like the traditional dialects spoken by government officials in Madrid due to the Northern Spaniards who emigrated to this area during colonial times.

TRUE they all have different accents but are NOT Dialects.

Do americans speak a dialect of English no. Does the fact that the French, the Saudis etc now say "parking" "Building" etc mean that they now speak dialects of their "original" language.......No.

Regional Colloquialisms, accents. The language is still the language in question. Spanish is the language in this case. Learn to speak, read, write Spanish and you will have no problems in any part of the Spanish speaking world. "Perdoname" is still "Perdoname"

[JenLN]

I didn't mean to start an argument, but it seems like it just depends on how you define "dialect." Here's what Merriam-Webster.com has to say:

Main Entry: di·a·lect
Pronunciation: 'dI-&-"lekt
Function: noun
Usage: often attributive
Etymology: Middle French dialecte, from Latin dialectus, from Greek dialektos conversation, dialect, from dialegesthai to converse -- more at DIALOGUE
1 a : a regional variety of language distinguished by features of vocabulary, grammar, and pronunciation from other regional varieties and constituting together with them a single language <the Doric dialect of ancient Greek> b : one of two or more cognate languages <French and Italian are Romance dialects> c : a variety of a language used by the members of a group <such dialects as politics and advertising -- Philip Howard> d : a variety of language whose identity is fixed by a factor other than geography (as social class) <spoke a rough peasant dialect> e : REGISTER 4c f : a version of a computer programming language
2 : manner or means of expressing oneself : PHRASEOLOGY
- di·a·lec·tal /"dI-&-'lek-t&l/ adjective
- di·a·lec·tal·ly /-t&l-E/ adverb


Maybe I'll just play it safe and say obnoxiously in my Mid-Western US accent, "Excus-o me, SEEN-YOR!" like many of the other tourists probably do. I'm sure they'll catch on!

[ELECTRA]

thanks jen!

[denisea]

Originally Posted by ELECTRA

TRUE they all have different accents but are NOT Dialects.

From the The Columbia Guide to Standard American English, 1993.

DIALECT

Our language practices vary regionally and socially. The dominant community, the chief constituency of speakers to which we belong, provides us with our regional dialect (or with a mixture of regional dialects) and with the features of our social dialect (or a mixture of social or class dialects). We learn these dialects from parents, siblings, playmates, and a great many others who influence us during our most formative years, and we further modify our personal idiolects as we later encounter new influences. Like our clothes and our other manners, our dialects tell others where we are from and give strong evidence of our formal education or lack of it, of our economic status, and of our social class.

Dialects differ from languages, generally speaking, in that different dialects of a given language are usually mutually intelligible, albeit occasionally with some difficulty at first. For example, Americans and Australians each speak a dialect of the English language and usually have little trouble understanding one another. An accent—whether an American Southern accent or a German or other foreign accent in English—is often just another label for a dialect different from one’s own. In a technical sense, however, accent involves only sound, whereas dialect can involve sound, spelling, grammar, and vocabulary.

[tommy]

Originally Posted by denisea

From the The Columbia Guide to Standard American English, 1993.

ELECTR_? Dont mess with the Moderator...you laungage scholar with sexy shoes..

[DavidB]

Now this is the Electra I remember