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Old 05-31-2017   #16 (permalink)
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Even if you don't believe in climate change,is it wrong to try and make our planet healthier?
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Old 05-31-2017   #17 (permalink)
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Even if you don't believe in climate change,is it wrong to try and make our planet healthier?
Nope. I have no problem with a clean environment. The Paris Accords do not guarantee a clean enrivonment.
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Old 05-31-2017   #18 (permalink)
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Nope. I have no problem with a clean environment. The Paris Accords do not guarantee a clean enrivonment.
It would certainly help!
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Old 05-31-2017   #19 (permalink)
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Paris Accords: In or Out?

I don't believe that man has much of an effect on climate (I believe our ego lets us believe that we can) but I think we should probably stick with the Paris Accords for a couple of reasons.
1. It is probably better for trade issues
2. The penalties for not complying are so weak as to not even matter.

One question that those who believe this is life or death must ask is how one man is able to take us out of the deal? How did that happen? Rhetorical questions because I already know the answer.
Stay in.

I do believe man can effect climate change...though not to the degree that many say. Long term, no checks on pollution etc has to take a toll.
Like you say though. If not for trade alone, we should stay involved. It's a win win IMHO. Potential to help the Earth as well as garnering good will.
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Old 05-31-2017   #20 (permalink)
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Stay in.

I do believe man can effect climate change...though not to the degree that many say. Long term, no checks on pollution etc has to take a toll.
Like you say though. If not for trade alone, we should stay involved. It's a win win IMHO. Potential to help the Earth as well as garnering good will.
Being part of a phony deal has no real upside. There is nothing in these accords that benefits the USA or the Western World for the price exacted. By being party to it we ratify it, making it more difficult to demur on the next cockamamie plan that comes down the pike as a precedent will have been set.
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Old 05-31-2017   #21 (permalink)
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It would certainly help!
How, specifically, will the environment be "cleaner" as a result of these accords?
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Old 05-31-2017   #22 (permalink)
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Being part of a phony deal has no real upside. There is nothing in these accords that benefits the USA or the Western World for the price exacted. By being party to it we ratify it, making it more difficult to demur on the next cockamamie plan that comes down the pike as a precedent will have been set.
I am looking at the upside only as a business move. I don't see a downside as the penalties for non-compliance amount to a light scolding and early bed time with no X-Box for the night.

What those who are so eager for this accord should be asking themselves is why Trump is able to render US participation null and void with a simple stroke of the pen. It is what happens when a President acts without the legislature. What can be done can be easily undone. That part will make me laugh, if it does happen.
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Old 05-31-2017   #23 (permalink)
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I am looking at the upside only as a business move. I don't see a downside as the penalties for non-compliance amount to a light scolding and early bed time with no X-Box for the night.
My concern is more for the precedent it will set as opposed to the potential financial penalties. Once we go in it will be that much harder to avoid the next one. Your point about the ease by which the accords can be set aside is also critical, by all rights this should have been dealt with as a treaty. The bewildered Mr Obama and the feckless Republicans failed in their duty on this one.
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What those who are so eager for this accord should be asking themselves is why Trump is able to render US participation null and void with a simple stroke of the pen. It is what happens when a President acts without the legislature. What can be done can be easily undone. That part will make me laugh, if it does happen.
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Old 05-31-2017   #24 (permalink)
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How, specifically, will the environment be "cleaner" as a result of these accords?
You have not even read any of it???

For one reducing the amount of dangerous emissions.

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The aim of the convention is described in Article 2, "enhancing the implementation" of the UNFCCC through:[9]

"(a) Holding the increase in the global average temperature to well below 2 °C above pre-industrial levels and to pursue efforts to limit the temperature increase to 1.5 °C above pre-industrial levels, recognizing that this would significantly reduce the risks and impacts of climate change;
(b) Increasing the ability to adapt to the adverse impacts of climate change and foster climate resilience and low greenhouse gas emissions development, in a manner that does not threaten food production;
(c) Making finance flows consistent with a pathway towards low greenhouse gas emissions and climate-resilient development."
Countries furthermore aim to reach "global peaking of greenhouse gas emissions as soon as possible". The agreement has been described as an incentive for and driver of fossil fuel divestment.[10][11]

The Paris deal is the world's first comprehensive climate agreement.[12]

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Old 05-31-2017   #25 (permalink)
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Trump’s window for scoring early legislative victories is shrinking

Trump's frustration about needing 60 votes in the Senate is BS. Two of his major initiatives can be done with 51 votes, but the Senate GOP can't get to 51 votes. I guess we could call them the grown-ups in the room

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President Trump faces an increasingly narrow path to win major legislative victories before the looming August recess, with only two months left to revive his health-care or tax initiatives before Congress departs for a long break.

White House officials said Tuesday that Trump has become increasingly incensed that legislation is bogging down in the Senate, something they blame on Democrats. Trump wrote on Twitter that the Senate should change its long-standing rules and “switch to 51” votes to pass health-care changes and to vote on a tax bill instead of working to get 60 votes to end a potential filibuster.

But the Senate is already trying to pass health-care and tax changes with just 51 votes, something it is unable to do because of splits within the GOP.

“The hardest thing now is figuring out what can get 51 votes in the Senate,” said Stephen Moore, who was a top economic adviser to Trump during the campaign and who has urged the White House to move more quickly.
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Old 05-31-2017   #26 (permalink)
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You have not even read any of it???

For one reducing the amount of dangerous emissions.
It is all blather, there are no specific targets that incur serious penalties if missed; it is rather like buying indulgences. Look at the history of such accords in the past, the Kyoto Protocol comes to mind, and let me know how that worked out. In some cases those who failed to sign on to that mess had a better record of reducing emissions than those who did.
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Old 05-31-2017   #27 (permalink)
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It is all blather, there are no specific targets that incur serious penalties if missed; it is rather like buying indulgences. Look at the history of such accords in the past, the Kyoto Protocol comes to mind, and let me know how that worked out. In some cases those who failed to sign on to that mess had a better record of reducing emissions than those who did.
Why do you even bother asking a question?
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Old 05-31-2017   #28 (permalink)
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Why do you even bother asking a question?
For the vanishingly small chance you will provide a substantive answer.
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Old 05-31-2017   #29 (permalink)
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You have not even read any of it???

For one reducing the amount of dangerous emissions.
That right there shows you just how ridiculous the whole thing is. Do you seriously believe that man can control the temperature? Which pre-industrial level temps are we going with? I will attach a menu for you.

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Old 05-31-2017   #30 (permalink)
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For the vanishingly small chance you will provide a substantive answer.
Godspeed.
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