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Old 08-15-2017   #46 (permalink)
aņejo
 
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Why were statues erected glorifying traitors to our country?

History has its place in books and records. Statues are erected to honor those deserving of honor and glory. So books and records are fine. Statues and other images for public display in town squares. No.

The Lost Cause Fallacy. That is the purpose of those statues. The Union was lenient in treatment of the Confederacy. But the Confederacy should not be honored. The Confederacy fought a Civil War to keep people enslaved. They were wrong and they were defeated. The continuous glorification of Confederate leaders suggests that the Confederate cause of fighting to keep slavery was justified. It wasn't.
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Old 08-15-2017   #47 (permalink)
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How many PI Trumspsters can you count in this picture?

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Old 08-15-2017   #48 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Stormin View Post
Why were statues erected glorifying traitors to our country?

History has its place in books and records. Statues are erected to honor those deserving of honor and glory. So books and records are fine. Statues and other images for public display in town squares. No.

The Lost Cause Fallacy. That is the purpose of those statues. The Union was lenient in treatment of the Confederacy. But the Confederacy should not be honored. The Confederacy fought a Civil War to keep people enslaved. They were wrong and they were defeated. The continuous glorification of Confederate leaders suggests that the Confederate cause of fighting to keep slavery was justified. It wasn't.
Ok, let's examine just the bolded line.

Again, I go back to Washington and Jefferson. The two of them had a large number of slaves. Did they do good for the country? Yes. Were they bad because they had slaves? Yes. We erected statues and monuments.

Robert E. Lee. One of the top graduates of the US Military Academy (#2 in his class) and in fact became the Commandant. Became President of Washington and Lee University. Did great things for the nation. But, also was on the side of the Confederacy. But, no monuments?

Sherman. With his "Scorched Earth" campaign, often thought of as a leader that was akin to Attila the Hun. But, he was a Union general. Statues OK?

Where/when do we draw the line?

And again I ask, were Washington and his ilk Patriots or Traitors when they stood up for their way of life in the face of the British rule?

Last edited by horizon200; 08-15-2017 at 09:13 AM..
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Old 08-15-2017   #49 (permalink)
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Ok, let's examine just the bolded line.

Again, I go back to Washington and Jefferson. The two of them had a large number of slaves. Did they do good for the country? Yes. Were they bad because they had slaves? Yes. We erected statues and monuments.

Robert E. Lee. One of the top graduates of the US Military Academy (#2 in his class) and in fact became the Commandant. Became President of Washington and Lee University. Did great things for the nation. But, also was on the side of the Confederacy. But, no monuments?

Sherman. With his "Scorched Earth" campaign, often thought of as a leader that was akin to Attila the Hun. But, he was a Union general. Statues OK?

Where/when do we draw the line?
Benedict Arnold did great things too...before becoming a traitor. Washington and Jefferson did not overthrow the United States government. They were traitors to Britain. But heroes to the United States.

Robert E Lee is not a hero to the United States. He was a traitor and killed United States soldiers while fighting for different nation.

If the Revolutionary War had failed and we remained under British rule we would not have a Washington Monument or a Jefferson Memorial.
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Old 08-15-2017   #50 (permalink)
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We'll just agree to disagree.
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Old 08-15-2017   #51 (permalink)
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For those progressives in California now talking about secession from the Union, should we consider charges of treason?
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Old 08-15-2017   #52 (permalink)
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For those progressives in California now talking about secession from the Union, should we consider charges of treason?
We had the same talk from Texas.

Wait until THEY fire the first shot. That is what we did last time.
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Old 08-15-2017   #53 (permalink)
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We'll just agree to disagree.
The problem is you can't teach someone history who thinks they have already learned it. But that doesn't mean you shouldn't keep trying. Some people would have you believe that slavery only existed in the South and that the North was just packed full of abolitionists.
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Old 08-15-2017   #54 (permalink)
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Benedict Arnold did great things too...before becoming a traitor. Washington and Jefferson did not overthrow the United States government. They were traitors to Britain. But heroes to the United States.

Robert E Lee is not a hero to the United States. He was a traitor and killed United States soldiers while fighting for different nation.

If the Revolutionary War had failed and we remained under British rule we would not have a Washington Monument or a Jefferson Memorial.
So then you agree that the statue of Lenin in Seattle needs to come down.
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Old 08-15-2017   #55 (permalink)
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For those progressives in California now talking about secession from the Union, should we consider charges of treason?
No, we should just thank them and help them to form their own country ASAP.

Governor Moonbeam becomes Chairman Moonbeam of the People's Republic of California, the Dems lose all those electoral votes, and the Blue Wall is destroyed for good.
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Old 08-15-2017   #56 (permalink)
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So then you agree that the statue of Lenin in Seattle needs to come down.
IMO, it should not be displayed on public ground.

President Trump might disagree though since he loves Russians so much.
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Old 08-15-2017   #57 (permalink)
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No, we should just thank them and help them to form their own country ASAP.

Governor Moonbeam becomes Chairman Moonbeam of the People's Republic of California, the Dems lose all those electoral votes, and the Blue Wall is destroyed for good.
Will the Southern States finally pay more money in then they take to make up for the financial shortfall?
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Old 08-15-2017   #58 (permalink)
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Will the Southern States finally pay more money in then they take to make up for the financial shortfall?
CA has the highest percentage of welfare recipients of any state. There will be no shortfall, only a net gain.

Oh... and your oft-quoted "fact" about Southern states is based on a discredited liberal talking point that includes military and other government spending as "welfare".
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Old 08-15-2017   #59 (permalink)
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Ivankaville sounds fantastic. Is marijuana legal there?
Death penalty for Pot. Ask Jeff Sessions.
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Old 08-15-2017   #60 (permalink)
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CA has the highest percentage of welfare recipients of any state. There will be no shortfall, only a net gain.

Oh... and your oft-quoted "fact" about Southern states is based on a discredited liberal talking point that includes military and other government spending as "welfare".
LOL. Southern States feed on the teat of Federal dollars. They are dependent on them.
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